In this episode of the She Finds Joy podcast, Kim has a conversation with Shannon Jamail the founder and creator of Mind & Body Complete.  She is a best-selling author, podcast host, and therapist turned performance coach who has a passion and a mission to elevate women in mind & body in order to connect, grow & thrive.


Shannon found traditional therapy to be extremely helpful but has found that when we treat the person from a holistic standpoint, that real change can begin to happen. In this episode, she explains that we all have emotional disruptions in our life whether it’s at work, in our relationships, with our thinking, or trauma we are dealing with. She also explains her three-step system for making our way through our emotional disruptions that lead to happiness and more fulfillment.

In today’s episode, Kim and Shannon talk about…

  • The reasons we get triggered by others’ actions and behaviors

  • The three ways for dealing with emotional disruption and getting through it

  • Why it’s so important to feel our feelings and not shove them down or bury them

  • Strategies for using the right side of your brain to regain emotional balance and stabilize the parasynthetic nervous system

  • Why your vagus nerve is so important to your emotional states

“…the only reason we get triggered by others is because it’s an insecurity within us…”

– Shannon Jamail


Check out to learn about Shannon’s retreats and coaching practice.

About Shannon

Shannon Jamial is the founder and creator of Mind & Body Complete.  She is a best selling author, podcast host, retreat leader, therapist turned performance coach, and tequila connoisseur (not really but she does enjoy sipping on a good pour).  Shannon has a passion and a mission to elevate women in mind & body in order to connect, grow & thrive through her programs & intentional products.  She lives on her ranch with her family in the Hill Country of Texas.  Find out more about her at 


She also hosts her podcast, You can follow her on Instagram, Facebook, or check out her website here. And here is her book

About Kim

Kim Strobel is Chief Happiness Officer at Kim Strobel Live Events and Retreats. She is a teacher, consultant, motivational speaker, happiness coach, and a mission-minded person whose passion is helping others overcome their fears and discover their joy! 

You can follow Kim’s journey on Instagram at @KimStrobelJoy and in the free private, She Finds Joy Facebook community.

Close Transcript

Kim Strobel 00:01

Welcome to the she finds joy podcast where I teach you how to step into the arena of bigness, all the while creating more joy along the way. That’s right. We are capable of reclaiming our power, our purpose, our boldness and bravery, and putting our bigness into the world. I’m Kim Strobel, your truth-telling Real Talk happiness coach who believes in giving you the tools to create a life you really love. After all, when we’re playing in our arenas of bigness, life gets better as we get older. So buckle up for the no BS zero fluff advice that gives you the small steps for big joy. Today I want to welcome Shannon Jamaal Shannon is the founder and creator of mind and body complete. She is a best selling author podcast host retreat leader, therapist turned performance coach, and tequila connoisseur. Not really. But she does enjoy sipping on a good pour. I already love you Shannon. And it has a passion and a mission to elevate women in mind and body in order to connect grow and thrive through her programs and intentional products. She lives on her ranch with her family in the hill country of Texas. Welcome to the show.

Thank you so so much. I am so so humbled and grateful to be here. You know, Texas is one of my favorite places to go. You know, I noticed on you know, your deal like all the places that you go to you do come to here to Texas quite often.

Kim Strobel 01:48
I do. I do. And I love that state and just I was there a week ago and I always find these lakes. You guys have amazing lakes around in that area. And then there’s all these beautiful homes and all these boats It’s out in the water. Yeah. Yeah. My husband laughs he’s like every time you travel Kim, that whatever that city is that you go to that’s the new place We’re supposed to be moving to.

Shannon Jamail 02:10
Yay. Yeah, no, it’s great. The people are great. And there’s, you know, lakes are definitely there’s so many lakes, especially where we’re at, in particular, there’s a lot of big lakes around us. So it’s wonderful.

Kim Strobel 02:22
Yeah, well jump in and tell us a little bit about who you are. I first of all, I do love like, you have the whole mind body connection. I’m somebody who very much believes that we have to integrate all of those things. But give us the background about like, where you were and how you became a performance coach.

Shannon Jamail 02:38
Yeah, well, my background goes all the way back to I used to be an executive in corporate, you know, life and all that fun stuff and but I was always interested in mental health as far as how the brain works and how our physical symptoms usually manifest from our emotional disruptions and sometimes vice versa, but a lot of times, it’s Mostly coming from our thoughts and our thinking and maybe stress levels and maybe some mental health disorders or you know, all kinds of goodies there. And so, when I decided to leave corporate America, I thought I’m gonna go to school and get my masters and I did that. And then I went through working as a clinical therapists and had a practice for a while and, and then realize that, you know, the way mental therapy is structured is beautiful. It really is. It’s a beautiful thing. I highly, highly recommend, really, honestly, can everybody to go and try it out because there’s all of us have something that we can really work through and figure out and see what’s underlying and some of our today issues, right, but, but one of the things that therapy does is it spends a lot of time in the history, right and in our past, and through that, sometimes we get stuck there. And the therapist has to be open and receiving to everything that a client is doing at that moment, which I love, but I really wanted to work in a way where we can get things accomplished and a little bit of a faster, less medical model role that we weren’t, you know, constrained,

Kim Strobel 04:57
Well, a couple of things. First of all, that you said that really resonated with me. And I am one of these people that 100% believes that we all need a coach or a counselor or someone in our life. Like I tell people I’ve been seeing my sweet Charlie for the last, I don’t know, 20 years and Charlie will always be in my life. Because I don’t know if I’m all need Charlie 10 times this year or three times this year, but what I know is that a better version of Kim Strobel happens when she works with Charlie, rather than trying to figure out all of this shit on her own.

Shannon Jamail 05:31

Kim Strobel 05:32
And the other thing that I like about him is You’re right. I think, as as good as you know, the field of mental therapy is there has been a ton of focus on like, Okay, well, let’s let’s dive into all of your childhood wounds. And let’s stay there for a really long time. And one of the things that Charlie’s always done with me is like, we’re going to look at those but I’m way more interested in giving you strategies to get to To where you’re going, because well then we can work and harp on all of that stuff for months on in. But I actually want to give you some tools and some strategies for getting out of that quicker and into what you really want.

Shannon Jamail 06:14
constrained by exactly what the medical model so we had to do, I kind of wanted to go outside of the box more. And, and so that’s why I decided to do coaching instead, which really says, Okay, this happened in the past. That’s great. And let’s work through that a little bit. But really, really, let’s see how we can use that in a different way today, and maybe look at it differently and use it differently so that we could focus on what is the goal today that we want to accomplish not what so much happened yesterday. And so that’s why I changed and really went into performance coaching and and then I you know, I started hosting retreats all over the world, really, and I primarily my demographic is women that I work with, and, and just really trying to figure out what’s your goal, what is your goal and how can we get there, and it usually involves both the mind and body in some way, and how can we elevate that?

Kim Strobel 07:01
Yeah, I agree. And I think that he was instrumental in my, you know, in my marriage too, because we also used him for marriage therapy. And I really want to be clear with our audience, because this is something that I feel really strongly about is just what you said. There’s nothing wrong with all of this reaching out and getting some help. It’s actually the most proactive thing that we can do. And most of the time when you find that really trusted coach, or therapist, I don’t, I don’t even like calling Charlie a therapist. I’ve actually called him a spiritual mentor, because I feel like he again has just helped with the evolvement of me and my soul and who I am. But people that finally take that first step and do that they are amazed at how helpful it really is in their life. So I really want to remove that host stigma for any of you out there who are thinking about that. It’s it’s actually a courageous and very strong choice to make to actually seek that help from someone else because you’re right. We’re so stuck in our own perceptions of things that we cannot disseminate all that’s going on in our heads and, and so I can’t wait to talk to you about all of these things today.

Shannon Jamail 08:16
Yeah, yeah. So true. So true. That’s, that’s a really really good way of looking at it is really trying to help people move past that stigma and I even like to look at it like if if finding help that Burbage doesn’t work for you. How about finding someone to work with you and your goals? Maybe Maybe you don’t know because I don’t want someone No One No One and I’ve had people at all varying degrees of mental health disruption. No one comes in broken necessarily. And I know people get real fond of that word broken. I just don’t feel bad. I feel that we’ve had situations that have happened or we have a thinking. I’m just really glad that you talked about the fact that there should not be a stigma with seeking the help. But I also encourage people if help sounds wrong, Right, because some people

I love it. And I love what you said is that you, Charlie helps, you know, you create you helps you but you’re doing it, you create the better version of you each time, right? And I think what’s important here is that a lot of times we don’t really even recognize that we can only process through a lens of our own experience, right? So whatever we’re viewing and doing and thinking it’s through the lens of our own experience. And so having another person, whoever they are somebody you trust, a mentor, a coach, a therapist, a psychiatrist, you know, whatever that looks like that can look at it in a different lens is so powerful. I just I can’t put enough stress on that. It’s just it’s so powerful that every human being could benefit and having some sort of person in their day. arena with them. You know what I mean?

Kim Strobel 09:28
Yes. And I love this idea of, you know, we do have so much that has happened in our past that we don’t even realize is there that is really operating in our present life and determining our future. And so I love that you really work on that, like let’s get you unstuck, you know, and then move you into the future because, you know, one of the things that I talk about when I’m teaching the growth mindset curriculum to people or students or adults or organizations is You know, we have these labels that get given to us from early on. And, and some of them might even seem like they’re positive label, but they’re really not. And some of them are very negative labels. So, for example, one of the labels that I was told all of the time is you know, Kim is really hyper. And Kim is careless Kim does everything way too fast. And I had these labels that did not that didn’t feel good, right when somebody was like, Oh, sure him so hyper all of the time. Because it made me feel less than it made me feel like something was wrong. I’m not fitting the quota of how I’m supposed to act and be in the world. And as an adult, it took me many years to realize that actually, that that level of intensity and if you want to call it hyperness, you could call it that but that’s what makes me really good on the stage right is like I contagious enthusiasm for life. And while it might make someone else feel like Wow, she’s quite a bit. It’s actually the thing that makes makes me who I am. And I find that we all have, we all have these labels, we were told when we were younger, and that continues to play out in our present life. Because you know, the view that you adopt for yourself, profoundly affects the way you lead your life. And so if you were told this label or this certain thing about you, and then that gets stuck and lodged in the back of your brain, and then that becomes an identity and that identity becomes a belief. And those beliefs are always driving your actions. And so I’m just curious, do you have anything to speak upon when it comes to, you know, this idea of these labels and how they really do affect us?

Shannon Jamail 11:44
Sure. Yeah. One thing I I asked people to consider is that when we are given a label, like for instance, Kim, if I label you as Kim, you’re you’re too hyper, right. Let’s just say I’d like people to consider that. I labeling you, right? The person who labeled you, they’re actually are like, Well, I’m not broken. And I don’t honestly think anybody’s broken. I think we all just have stuff, right. But if it helped that word doesn’t resonate with someone, I just encourage someone to look at it as, could you use assistance with your goals, right? Maybe a goal you have is to do something differently or to think differently or to feel differently. And so whether it’s help or whether it’s goals, or whether it’s just seeking some support. There is definitely no stigma in doing that. So I’m so grateful that you said that.

Kim Strobel 12:31
I’m gonna stop you right there. Observe that is so freakin profound. I have heard that before. But I’m not going to lie. I sometimes struggle to understand that so I want you to go even deeper. Like why is it there security because I am thinking to one particular person who she is like super zen and she’s super relaxed and she’s super private. And I will tell you that every time as a school teacher Like I walked into her office or into the same room, just the mere energetic presence of me sent her over the edge.

Shannon Jamail 13:10
Yes, yeah. Good. I’m so glad you said that. Because that is just another example of how it’s their own deficiency, their own insecurity and deficiency by meaning in their own mind. Not I’m labeling them that they just in their own mind, they see this as a deficiency or an insecurity. Or the third option is they fear it in their own life. Let me give you an example. To bring it to like a personal level. My daughter, who’s now 18, and she’s going off to college, and we are so close now, but when she was preteen teen, she really just did not take care of herself the way I felt a teenager should take care of herself, right? And so I was constantly picking at her like, Oh, you should wear your pants this way. Or you should wear your shirt this way or why don’t you take care of yourself or why do you and what I was really subconsciously doing to her? was thinking back to my own childhood. Heard when I was picked on for those things, and how insecure I felt at that time, and how I didn’t want her to experience these things, do you see what I’m saying? And how I was putting my junk on her. And that’s what someone does when they put a label on you. They’re putting their junk on you. It’s either something they’re afraid they will be, or they lack and wish they had. And so we always attack we always attack something that’s we’re insecure about or we’re ignorant about, or we’re, you know, we’re afraid we’re going to become, I mean, that really is always dry. So, think about it this way when you’re feeling really, really good, right? Do you think about somebody else in a negative way? I mean, really, when you feeling so good about yourself? Do you look at someone else and she shouldn’t wear that? Or you don’t because you feel so good about yourself? All right, yes, that’s so good.
labeling their own insecurity. And so when I label you as you’re too hyper, what I’m saying is I wish I had the energy you had, or subconsciously, I’m saying, I wish I could have that personality that Kim is just so, you know, she has the energy of being able to connect with people. She has this bubbly, you know, it’s, I’m telling you is 99.99999% of the time a label is somebody else’s insecurity that they’ve now put on to you. And someday

Kim Strobel 14:49
But now I am going to flip it because I want I need a little bit of self coaching here. Because I too have noticed that like my husband and I can get super judgey sometimes around people. So for example, there’s this person in our life, who has these kids and like, she just drives us crazy. Like, every single time we see her, she has to brag about our kids and tell us all that our kids are doing. And she just sickens us, like, we’re just like, Oh my gosh, like, What is wrong with her? And so like, we’re judging her as a parent. So like, are you tell, like, explain why I’m doing that? Are you saying that I’m feeling?

Shannon Jamail 15:30
There’s a couple different things not to interrupt? There’s a couple different things. Let me let me also clarify there are some times where we just think a thought and it just is there right. So right, that we just think, Oh, you know, that outfits too small or too big or whatever. That’s just observation. And there’s difference because there’s intention behind thoughts, right and an intention, your intention behind your thought is really what matters. So when you’re judging this, this person or a couple or whatever, when they’re doing this, the intention is what matters if your intention inside is like, oh, gosh, why do they do that? That’s so annoying. Is it because you feel like if you did it, it would be annoying? Is it because if you feel like you should do it more, is it because you know, like, you have to really dig into what’s your intention about? If it’s just I’m tired of hearing it, then Okay, then that might be it might just be I’m tired of hearing it. But usually, let’s let’s really dig into this. Usually, when we’re triggered by someone, it’s something within us. It’s not them. It’s usually something within us. So something within you is, is not liking what’s being presented to you. Whether, like I said, it might be one of those things where you think if you did what she did, it would be annoying, right? And so right, you think that maybe you think, well, if I said these things about my kids, or my niece and my nephew, whomever, that would just be so annoying if I did it, you know, so it’s annoying because she’s doing it, or, you know, that’s a big one or the other one is, do you feel like you should do it more with your kids. Maybe you don’t recognize your kids enough? I’m not saying you do or don’t say yeah, things that might be going through your head.

Kim Strobel 16:57
So let me just go there with you for a minute. I’m thinking, I’m thinking, would you please shut your damn mouth and for once asked me about my kid because I get so sick of hearing you talk about your kids constantly to me. And then I try to share one little thing and you just trumped me. And I just am and I just leave every conversation if I perceive this person at Walmart or wherever, and it just fires me up, and then I get mad at myself cuz

I’m like, I don’t choose to hang out with this person. So like, why does it annoy me if I have to see her every few weeks in Walmart, and I have to hear her bullshit story of her kids, but, but it’s like, I find myself coming home. And then I’m telling my husband about on my guess what she did this time, you know?

Shannon Jamail 17:44
So honestly, this would take some work on your part to really dig into why is this triggering you? Because let’s let’s look at it this way. If it were me, right, I’m just making it up and I saw her and these things happen. It may not trigger me at all. I might just be like, Oh, she is who she is. She likes to talk about her. Kids, then I just sent her love and move on my way, you know what I’m saying? Yeah, well, and that might be the other thing too is you’ve got to do that, that practice of, you know, she needs this attention for some reason, right? So she needs this attention, she’s craving something, she’s lacking something, she needs some attention. And so if you send her love, and just release it, it might also untangle what’s happening inside of you. But the only reason we get triggered sister and this is a hard one for all of us. The only reason why we get triggered Is this something in us, it’s not that other person. Right? It just isn’t. And I know that’s really, you know, not what people like to hear. And it’s, it’s there’s lots of disagreement with that, which I’m totally open to but but otherwise, just think about the fact that, you know, you meet other people and they don’t trigger you and they might say weird, stupid, silly, Goofy, you know, things. So there’s something there that’s triggers you something that’s triggering something within you that you’re not liking and it could be very deep subconsciously that you’re just not it’s not readily available to snap up. But there’s a trigger. And it has nothing to do with the fact that she’s obviously someone who, you know, might be a little bit self centered and right could be, but it really usually, even if that was the case, even if it was just that she’s self centered, it wouldn’t trigger you. Right? He would just kind of giggle about it and go, Okay, good to see it, you know, like, yeah, like, and so there’s a trigger in there somewhere. And it has something to do with what you’re feeling about you more than what you’re feeling about her.

Kim Strobel 19:26
Okay, so I always pull quotes out of the podcast. And so I wrote this down, but I want you to finish it for me. So the only reason we get triggered is because and then what did you say?

Shannon Jamail 19:35

Kim Strobel 19:40
I love that. And it This is something I do totally believe. But then I find myself coming up with scenarios where I’m like, Well, I don’t know what she’s triggering inside of me. I just think I just don’t like this person.

Shannon Jamail 19:54
But you’re right. I’ve had that to listen, I could talk about this all day and I meet someone and go oh, no, this is Hoping to be a person in my circle. And that’s okay. You know, for whatever reason, and honestly, if I’m being super, super, super, super honest with myself, it’s some insecurity in me whatever it might be, and maybe I don’t want to spend time figuring this shit out. Maybe I just want to move on and say this is not the person for me. But always if we’re triggered, it’s in us. It’s always in us,

Kim Strobel 20:20
which makes perfect sense because I, when I talk about walking in the room, just my mere presence, it doesn’t affect everyone like that. It just affects that one woman an hour, right? It is. It is. And I love that and I encourage all of our listeners to think about that to think about the crap that triggers us and to figure out where our ownership is in that piece. Because I do wholeheartedly believe that quote, it’s a hard one to swallow sometimes I’m not gonna lie, but I do believe it is true. So oh my gosh, this that right there has just been great. So all of our listeners, I want you to think about the people and the crap and the things that Trigger you and figure out what is it inside of you that is feeling either insecure or wounded or whatever it might be. And understanding that we have a personal responsibility to flip that script for ourselves.

Shannon Jamail 21:17
Listen, I do this to myself about to come work. I might be reading a book or watching something or listening to something and I get triggered, right? I get fired up. And it’s like, okay, what’s happening here and that’s the time for me to ask myself, I could do one of two things here I can, I can explore this and figure it out and go through what I call it. afco another fucking growth opportunity. I’m like, screw it. Again. It’s ASCO AF. Other fucking opportunity. I love it. I could do this. Or I could say I don’t want to grow today. I’m just gonna move on past this. You know, we always have that opportunity. Whenever we’re
It’s something within us. It’s not that other person being within us.

Kim Strobel 22:14
Oh, girl. Oh, girl. Yes, I do. Yes. I feel everything. So, oh my gosh, now. Okay, so I want to go into this topic that you talk a lot about, which is emotional disruption. What, what is an emotional disruption?

Shannon Jamail 22:29
Yeah. So emotional disruption is anytime we’re feeling an extra layer of anxiety or stress or anger or sadness, you know, we go through all of these emotions, okay. So they’re all normal. Anytime someone tells me Well, I have too much stress. It’s like, well, let’s talk about that. Because there’s a certain level of stress of just living in day to day life that we’re just that’s normal, right? Yeah. So but when you’re going above that, right, and I normal is different for everybody. So I’m not going to tell you what a normal layer is, you know, and the way you know is Maybe some part of your life is just not functioning the way you’d like it to maybe your relationships are a little disjointed right now, maybe work is really difficult. It’s more difficult for you to get along with people at work, you know, there’s just a disruption somewhere in your functioning of life, which tells me there’s an emotional disruption somewhere going on, right? Yeah. And so yeah, so that’s and that can that can stem from, like I said, it could stem from something going on currently, in our relationships at work in our mind and our thinking, or it could even be a past trauma that has happened or a past situation that’s happening for whatever reason is bubbling up today. And that could be consciously or subconscious. And so all of these things can lead to what I call emotional disruption.

Kim Strobel 23:41
That, okay, yes, yes. I feel like I’m in the middle of a ton of emotional disruptions right now. Just with everything, right?

Shannon Jamail 23:51
Yeah, and that’s a good point, too. It can also just come from external, right. I mean, just being triggered, and triggered, you’d feel like you just said it could feel like a noise. It could feel like you can even feel kind of like attacks but you’re not even sure why you’re feeling attacked. You just feel that way. You could just be you know, I don’t know, they just get on your nerves. You know what I mean? Like there’s all different kinds of ways a trigger feels, but you know what it feels like because you feel it in your body even

Kim Strobel 25:19
Oh, I love that.

Shannon Jamail 25:21
So yeah, so we’ve got to feel them, we got to take some time, you know, turn the phone off, put it away, take a bath, sit in your closet, whatever it is, journal it out, cry it out, scream it out, talk it out. You know, you’ve got to dig in, you’ve got to lean into what you’re feeling. And I like to say that we we will lean into it until we no longer has power over us. Now, that might not all happen in one session. That might not happen in one, you know, sit down, you might have to like lean in, feel it, dig it, dig into it. And then you might have to say, Okay, I need a break. And that’s when you would go to distraction, right and then you would come back to digging in as you can. So but then, after you’ve dug in and you’re leaning in and you’re really trying to get into it, the next thing that you would do is distraction.

Kim Strobel 26:00
Okay, so step two is distraction.

the state of the world that we’re in right now is, is one big giant. Okay. Emotional disruption. I mean, it really just is. It’s actually what we like to save. And if I were to switch gears and go into a clinical realm, this is a constant state of emotional trauma that we’re in with everything that’s going on with COVID-19. And then, with the injustices that we’re, you know, fighting through in the protests, and just all the kind of stuff that’s going on, there’s so much turmoil that puts us in emotional trauma. And so obviously, emotional trauma is, you know, going to be causing emotional disruption. But what I like to say is that there are three ways of dealing with emotional disruption. Yeah, and I call them my triple D’s in I can just briefly go over all the view. Yeah, yeah. So the first one is digging in. The second one is distraction or doing and the third one is digest. And so basically, what it looks like is digging in is kind of like leaning into it, leaning into what you’re feeling your emotional disruption. What does it you know, what does it feel like? Because, listen, we all for whatever reason, I don’t know if we’re, you know, brought up this way. Just happens, we start to think that we’re only supposed to feel happiness and everything else we’re supposed to fix. And that’s not the case. We’re supposed to feel our feelings. They’re meant to be felt. It’s actually when we try to just stuffed them away or numb them away, or put them under the carpet. That’s when we really start to see that the emotional disruptions turn into physical disruptions.

Shannon Jamail 26:02
Yeah, step two is distraction or doing. And that’s basically when digging in becomes too much, or you just need another tool, you need a break. And so this is real simple, real simple tools, tools. You know, watch a read humorous things, you know, we all know laughter makes a big difference in our life, right? And so emotional disruption can totally be disrupted by laugh, laughter. And then the other things that we all know reading, creating art, watching a movie or documentary, chatting with your friends, other things sewing, a cleaning and organizing is a big one. Oh my goodness. You know, for a lot of people that just really kind of helps bring clarity into their, their brain is just cleaning and

Kim Strobel 26:42
you know what, for me, so this is one of the things my therapist Charlie taught me is, when I am emotionally charged, and feeling all of my feelings I can sometimes get really out of whack like especially if I’m in a disagreement with my husband or whatever it might be. And so then he tells me the very best thing I can do is go take a run. Let him run out.

Shannon Jamail 27:06
Yeah, that’s, that’s the other one is exercise. I always like to say if you can’t work it out, go work it out, right? Yeah. If you can’t work out whatever’s bothering you, or you’re dealing with and go work out and and whatever that looks like, if it’s a run, if it’s a swim, if it’s a fast walk, that’s yoga, if it’s whatever it is, right, because everybody’s got their jam. Yeah.

Kim Strobel 27:25
Then let me ask you this. When I ask you this, do we sometimes miss use distraction to keep us from feeling all the fields like, do we not want to feel the way we do? So we veg out on social media for an hour, which really doesn’t serve a good purpose? Like do we abuse distraction, too?

Shannon Jamail 27:49
Yes. So I like to first of all, social media good and I just don’t even want to say this, but I feel like it’s the source of all evil and sometimes Yeah, and I use social media for business I realized that hypocrisy there. But social media is not where we need to spend time on, we’re in emotional disruption. Matter of fact, I tell my clients when we’re in emotional disruption, you need to turn it off for however long until you’ve worked through your emotional disruption, because all that’s going to do is not only keep you in this space, but

Kim Strobel 29:20
That’s that’s, that clarifies it. For me, we are talking about distraction in a way that positively contributes to you being able to somewhat digest and resolve this issue.

Shannon Jamail 29:31
Yes, yes, exactly. One of the other things that I’ll tell you that we could work on is the vagus nerve, believe it or not, the vagus nerve is super powerful. It’s the longest nerve in our body. A lot of people are not very familiar with Vegas nerve. Or maybe they are, they just don’t realize what it all does. But it’s the only nerve in our body that connects to the brain, heart, lungs, and gut which the gut is really big for us, as well as all of our sensory throughout the body. And so It’s the key part of our parasympathetic, rest and digest nervous system. And so when we can work on our vagal tone, which is how you know effective our biggest nervous, that’s when we can start to affect to how we’re feeling and how we’re able to rest and relax and then better able to process. And so just real quickly a couple things.

Kim Strobel 30:20
Yeah, I’m real interested because you know, you’re talking to the girl who suffered greatly from crippling Yes, order. Yeah. So when you say the word Paris, you know, synthetic, sympathetic system, which I wish I could just live in that system all of the time. So yeah, we need a stress reliever associated to this. I’m highly intrigued. So keep going.

it’s also going to add comparison and some other bullshit on there. So social media is not the thing. The other thing that you won’t see in my list is drink more right? or, or, or any kind of drugs or you know, I’m not going to tell you to do all those things as your as your form of distraction, because that’s not numbing it out. Even if it’s hours and hours and hours of mindless TV is not necessarily the great distraction either. So I’m more like, we need to use the creative side of our brain, right? We need to use the creative or the humorous side of our brain like we need to tap into those sections. Music, our journal right? Create like that’s, that’s to me that distraction tools that I’m talking about. Yeah. The other one would be mindfulness. You know, any way that you can practice mindfulness, whether it’s through breath work, or, you know, focusing on the present moment working through acceptance, meditation, you know, writing out a thankful journal, whatever it might be, but but any type of mindfulness is a really great distraction, as well. And so those are some some big on that.

Shannon Jamail 30:41
Yeah. So the way we work on our vagal tone is through vagus nerve stimulation, and there’s a few different ways we could do that and and I highly recommend taking a few that work for each person and just start practicing them. One is cold exposure, and I know my not a whole lot of people like to cold exposure. But it really is exactly what it sounds like taking the coldest bath you can take or cold dip. Really? Yeah, so cold exposures really, really fabulous for our vagus nerve.

Kim Strobel 31:10
So like you’re saying if I am starting to feel anxious or panicky or overwhelmed or mentally frazzled, that I should maybe like, jump in and take a really cold shower.

Shannon Jamail 31:25
So what I like to do first is I like to tell people you know, if you have a bath and a shower even better, get into hot hot water. Right, and then get into a cold shower.

Kim Strobel 31:34
Wow, I’m all about the hot bath. So yeah.

Shannon Jamail 31:37
And so you finish it always with cold which is really hard. And you can even go back and forth like I don’t know if you’re familiar with a lot of these health spas, the ones that are focused on health as well as you know, the massages and facials and stuff they’ll have the hot cold plunges. Yeah, and there’s a reason for that. It’s super, super fabulous for our nervous system. And so if you can if you have both and you have that ability to like, you know, sit in the hot bath and get in the shower, sit in the hot bath and take a shower. If you can do that, a good three to five times. I am telling you right now sister it will change your life. It will change your life.

Kim Strobel 32:14
So like I need to sit in the hot bath for what five minutes and then the shower for

Shannon Jamail 32:18
No, you don’t even have to do that. No, you could sit in the hot bath for about a minute or two I would say a minute to three minutes. And then the shower is only 30 seconds. And then hot bath the minute to three minutes and then the shower 30 seconds. The key is when you’re done with your rotation and you’re like okay, I’m finished. You have to end with the cold.

Kim Strobel 32:35
Gotcha. Okay, okay,

Shannon Jamail 32:37
so cold exposure. Another one is slow and deep breathing, which I know a lot of us know that slow and deep breathing can affect how we feel and it affects our emotional setup, but you know, really, really understanding and maybe coming up with a breath work that that resonates with someone is super, super important. One of the ones that I like to use is a 468 process. So inhaling to a count of four Holding for a count of six, exhaling for a count of eight. And so just nice, slow and deep. If you can do that, again three to five times in the moment that you’re not feeling, right, it can make a big difference. So slow and deep breathing.

Kim Strobel 33:15
That’s so good. And let me just tell you that. So most people begin to over breathe when they have a panic attack. I stop breathing, I hold my breath again. So breath work is a real important part. I’m actually going to add this to my note card, the 468 I like that. So 468 I love it.

Shannon Jamail 33:34
I like to tell people to practice deep breathing even when you don’t need it. Because it’s like, it’s like what I like to say is, it’s in you can appreciate this. It’s impossible to have a panic attack if you’re slow, deep breathing, but it’s also impossible to slow deep breathing when you’re in a panic attack. If you haven’t been practicing it, right. Wait a minute, you can’t. You can’t just say oh, I feel panic attack coming on. Let me Hurry up and slow, deep breath. That doesn’t work. You had to have this As part of your system as part of your tool,

Kim Strobel 34:01
I’m writing myself a note card right now and putting it next to my meditation chair. Because I do know that the value of practicing is so that it becomes second nature to have the skills. So I’m going to practice this during my meditation love it. Okay, going.

Shannon Jamail 34:19
Alright, singing humming and chanting. You know, we’d like to sometimes some people like the make fun of the woowoo of some of the Yogi’s who chant and hum and all that stuff. There’s actually science behind it that really is incredible for the for the vagus nerve. And here’s what’s funny, you know, I think we kind of know that because if we seem even if we suck at singing how good you feel when you sing, right? I mean, you just do. And performers will always tell you they have that real big high when they get offstage. It’s not just because they were performing for people. It’s actually the singing it’s it’s what it’s stimulating that does that.

Kim Strobel 34:51
So I did read that in a book, by the way, that when you start to have a panic attack, start singing and you can’t have both you can’t have the panic and besides

Shannon Jamail 35:00
So yeah, so if you can sing or sneeze, just your brains not a casino it depends on where you’re at in your in your stage of panic attack. If your brains not able to function on words, you can hum and just maybe pick one or two words and chant it over and over and over again. And so yeah. Probiotics Believe it or not, it’s real great for the biggest nerve as well as omega three fatty acids. So if those are two supplements that are not in your diet, I highly recommend but also I’m not a big person on like taking a bunch of supplements because I think you should only take what you need. Otherwise you’re just pissing it out. Like you really are literally passing it out.

Kim Strobel 35:37
What are some omega three fatty acids?

Kim Strobel 36:03
Yeah, I actually ordered chia seeds from like in bulk from Amazon and I just put a scoop of them in my protein shake in the morning.

Shannon Jamail 36:11
Perfect. Perfect.

Kim Strobel 36:13
Not feeling so good about myself, Shannon.

Shannon Jamail 36:15
Yes, girl, I love chia seeds. And then we know meditation is really great. That’s just got so many great things all the way around, but it does help with the biggest nerve. And then this is a fun one, but massages specifically foot massages. But massages really help work on the biggest nerve. And then lastly is laughter And again, that’s the vibration. Mostly in the throat area. So

Kim Strobel 36:40
Oh my god, yeah. Oh, interesting. I love that. Okay, so those are all going to be helpful for step two, which is distraction. Yeah. And then the last step of this you said is digest

Shannon Jamail 36:53
Yeah, so digest is what can you learn from this? right and and you get to digest pretty much when you feel like you’ve worked Through, you’ve leaned in, you’ve distracted where you needed to, maybe you’ve leaned back in. And now you’re at the place where it’s like, what can I learn from this? What is the takeaway here? What is my lesson out of this and there’s always a lesson even if you’re in the midst of grief, or the just the, the worst kind of

Okay, fish oils, yep, fish, and then also chia seeds. Yeah, so there’s an omega threes and lots of different things. You have to be very purposeful these days though to really get it into your diet. And so sometimes it is easier to take a supplement but Definitely You know, there’s some natural well you can get it in there too.

Kim Strobel 38:31
the action is the action sometimes where you’re like, Hey, I’m going to stop with that thought and choose a better feeling thought

Shannon Jamail 38:38
you absolutely can. But remember, sometimes when we’re doing that, our underlying thought is still saying, Yeah, you’re not fooling me. And you do that enough to where you can, right? You influence your thoughts. Yes, you can, or you change your activities to where it does and it does change your thoughts. But also You’re going to have a thought. And then you are actually choosing a reaction. It might be the opposite of that thought it might be in Luton, you know, in favor of that thought. But we actually influence our thoughts. And we choose our actions or reactions, same thing.

Kim Strobel 39:13

Shannon Jamail 39:14
how you can think of, there’s always something that you can learn. There’s always a lesson, there’s always a takeaway, even if it is to prepare you to maybe help somebody else in the future. And so there’s always there’s always a benefit a lesson. And then even just asking, what’s, is there another perspective? Or do I need to spend some time doing acceptance work is this is where I really need to say what’s within my control and what’s not within my control, and sending what’s not my control out with love just knowing that, you know, it’s not in your control. And there’s so much that’s not in our control. By the way, there’s really only one thing that’s in our control, and I’m going to give you a hint and tell you it’s not your thoughts, and that’s different than what most people think is our thoughts. We actually don’t and let me give you an example how many times have Have you done something in your head, you’re like, I don’t want to do this. I don’t want to be here. I hate this. I hate doing this. I don’t want to I don’t exercise. I don’t want to eat this or whatever it is like your thought that’s what you’re thinking, what are you choose otherwise, so we can influence our thoughts. But we don’t always choose them. The only thing we choose is our action. So I might be thinking, I don’t want to do this, but I choose to do it anyway. And I do it anyhow. Because I know that it’s the right decision to do right or whatever. Or maybe I do it. And I know it’s not the right decision, but I do it anyway. And so are

Shannon SJamail 39:14
a certain degree. So yeah, so but once we imagine if we ever really truly and I’m not there either listen, but if we ever really truly got to that place where we accept what we control, which is only our actions, and our reactions could just imagine how much more peaceful life would be. I’m not saying you would have everything exactly the way we would want. But does it but it doesn’t always line up the way we want. Anyway, when we’re fighting and we’re resisting, and we’re trying to control, you know,

Kim Strobel 39:41
so much of life is about like, you know, whatever you resist persists, right? Hmm. So, your son, I have been able to do that with some really hard things in my life. I have been able to surrender and accept and and that pathway gives me Way more relief than the constant fighting of free tiller. Yeah, situation. You know, like even for years I I just despised the idea that I I was a divorced person that I had divorced and remarried and I just just thought it like, Why couldn’t I have married the right person the first time? Why did I have to share my son back and forth every other weekend with his dad, you know, and I just kept resisting it against what I felt like should have been my life. Right?

Shannon Jamail 40:31

Kim Strobel 40:32
And I finally like, do you know how much suffering was caused by me envisioning if that didn’t have to happen?

Shannon Jamail 40:40
Yes. Yeah.

Kim Strobel 40:41
And so I finally did finally I think it was just a couple of years ago. You know what it was? I’ll tell you what it was. This is what did it my son did it for me, because he and I, he’s gonna be turning 20 and we were in his dad and I divorced or by left his dad when He was about two months old. And he’s 20 now, and we were having a conversation and I just said, you know, Spencer, I, I just have a lot of guilt I could couldn’t stay in the marriage. But I just have a lot of guilt over you having to go back and forth between two homes and I, when he went to college, I kind of looked at it like, look at all the days I missed with him, like, let’s take every other weekend, right times 18 Sure. And, and he looked at me and said, Mom, I wouldn’t have had it any other way. And I said, Really? He said, Well, I mean, he, he’s really close to my husband, Scott who came into his life when he was like a year old and he said, I would have never had Scott in my life. And so it was a different story that he had told himself than what I was telling myself about. him in his experience. And I finally got to like acceptance. Like, maybe the story I’ve created around this situation is really not the only story that’s there.

Shannon Jamail 42:13
Yeah, that’s so powerful. Yeah, I think acceptance work can literally be the biggest game changer in anybody’s existence if I’m being honest. Because there’s so much there’s so much that we carry around all day, every day thinking that either it’s our responsibility, or it should be our responsibility or whatever may be the case. And the truth is, there’s very little within our control. We can still have goals and we can still influence our life but, but if we can, you know, come to that place of peace and acceptance, it’s just so much more freeing. It’s just it really is and so, and I love how you said the story you were telling yourself and you’re probably familiar with Bernie Brown. Oh, girl. Yeah. Because that’s that’s a big deal. That’s that’s, that’s such a powerful thing. And I think it’s A great way of opening a conversation with someone like your son or a spouse or significant other friend. It’s like, you know, the story I’ve been carrying and telling myself is this and maybe hoping for, you know, some understanding or a different perspective there. So, that’s really powerful girl. Yeah, acceptance is a big one. So yeah, so yeah, so digest is the last step really, and to help remove some of this emotional disturbance is is is to what is my perspective here? What what kind of acceptance work do I need to do? What do I need to surrender? And what did I learn? And then you’ve you by that point, you’ve really worked through that emotional disturbance. That is so very good.

Kim Strobel 43:37
Oh, my goodness. Okay. So a couple of things that I want to do before we in this one in a second, I’m gonna let you tell our audience where they can find you where they connect with you. And then actually, when you brought Bernie brown up, so I’ve been listening to her podcast unlocking you. Yes. And she does this really cool thing at the end of our podcast where she’ll ask like, 10 Rapid Fire question. And I’m like, that would be so fun to do with my clients. So we’re going to do five at the end here. But first I want you to tell my people where can they find more information about you and connect with you?

Shannon SJamail 44:12
Yeah, so it’s real simple. You just go to, and you can find and dry social media. Yeah, social media and everything. You can shoot me an email. And, and I’d love to hear from you.

Kim Strobel 44:24
Oh, that’s so good. That is so good. I love this emotional disruption. And then also, if they’re interested in your best selling book is called surrender, right? Yes. And you can get that on Amazon or from my website. Okay, cool. We’ll drop all that in the show notes. Okay, are you ready for the Rapid Fire question?

Shannon Jamail 44:39
I think

Kim Strobel 44:42
Here we go. What’s, what’s the one show that you you’ve been bingeing lately?

Shannon Jamail 44:47
I always it’s the same damn show, girl. You’re gonna laugh. It’s Modern Family. I could watch the same show over and over and over and over again.

Kim Strobel 44:55
favorite character on there? Because my swears I’m Claire. And I’m like My goodness

Shannon Jamail 45:00
Yeah, no, I that’s my show, bro.

Kim Strobel 45:02
I love Claire too. I love Claire too. There’s actually this scene where she and Phil go to a
hotel for the weekend. And they they do roleplay and they Oh, yes. Oh, and I’m like, we should do that Scott. That would be so much. Oh my gosh, yes. Clyde Bixby Clyde fisty Yeah. What is one of your luxuries that you give yourself?

Shannon Jamail 45:24 My massages weekly?

Kim Strobel 45:26
Oh, me too.

Shannon Jamail 45:29
Yeah, and minor deep tissue ones, the kind that you don’t you cringe but afterwards, it feels so good.

Kim Strobel 45:33
Yeah, me too. I’m like, push as hard as you want. I need that you realize all that stuff from my body? Okay, here’s the third one. What’s something that people maybe don’t know about you?

Shannon Jamail 45:45
I dropped out of high school. And then my sophomore year I started my sophomore year high school and then I thought that I was too good for high school dropped out. Then go my whole sophomore year and then my junior year I woke up as a Yeah, that’s not a good idea. So my junior and senior year at had to take sophomore classes and ended up graduating with honors.

Kim Strobel 46:05
Wow. Your parents freak out.

Shannon Jamail 46:08
You know my parents are divorced. My mom lived in Ohio. My dad lived in California. I

Kim Strobel 46:16
Ah, gotcha. Yep. Okay, you are the rebel. Alright, question number four. What’s your favorite food?

Shannon Jamail 46:23
Man, it’s pizza. But pizza doesn’t always like me.

Kim Strobel 46:26
Ah, yeah. So you know, you’re gonna pay for it. You’re a nice man if you do it.

Shannon Jamail 46:30

Kim Strobel 46:31
And then I always end with this one here. How are you Shannon reaching for more joy in your life right now.

Shannon Jamail 46:38
You know, I’m doing a better job of just appreciating the here and now even if the here now is not exactly what I’m wanting. And I feel like when I can do that, like, you know, I think I might have mentioned to before we recorded, I’m living in between right now our house is being built. So I’m living in an RV. And we had sold our California house and so we’re in between and it’s it’s not fun to be between an RV with kids but you know the truth of it is is it can be you know it really can be and and so really just finding the here and now and what’s cool about the here now and not worrying about why wish I had this or I wish we should have rented a house or whatever it’s more like this this here now it’s pretty cool so yeah flew back and forth and I went through a real rebel stage my sophomore year and said, I don’t need either of you.

Kim Strobel 47:18
that’s excellent I need to work on that too oh my gosh Shannon you’ve been like we could we could talk forever and ever and ever about so many topics but I you have the same Kim Strobel energy you talk fast you move you know like we have like I don’t know if this is like a 40 minute recording but most people would take like 60 minutes but we just went through it girl

Shannon Jamail 47:40
I’m also the one that listens I don’t know if you do I listen to podcasts and watch videos at like one and a half speed.

Kim Strobel 47:45
Oh me too!
Shannon Jamail 47:48
yes I do to even the fun ones because I have my self development ones and they have my fun books and I’m like I do yes, I talk way too fast.

Kim Strobel 47:56
Give me the information. Oh my gosh, well what up pleasure and it’s so nice to have you. Thank you again.

Shannon Jamail 48:03
Thank you so much.

Kim Strobel 48:06
We did it. Thank you so much for listening in on the she finds joy podcast today. I’m honored to share this space with you and I hope you keep showing up as the real you in this world. As always, this conversation will be continued in our free private Facebook group. You can join that group by going to Kim Strobel comm forward slash she finds joy to connect with other joy seekers just like you